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Thread: Erma EP 25 (.25 ACP)

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    Elite Members SgtR's Avatar
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    Default Erma EP 25 (.25 ACP)

    A poster has asked questions about a .25 ACP Erma on the WTB Board where they can't be answered... but here are some of my somewhat opinionated answers:

    To look for parts or whole guns, the correct nomenclature is Erma-Werke EP25 (oder wenn sie Deutsch sprechen, Erma-Werke EP25 Taschen-Pistole). They have pot-metal (zinc) frames and since by federal law their frame is the firearm and yours is broken, you really have a something useless that can't be fixed and wouldn't be much good if it were fixed... essentially nothing at all, except it might get someone in trouble anyway if they carried it around in their pocket (even in unfirable condition) without a license. Back in the days those were made, in the '60s and '70s, used ones went for about 20 bucks "on the street". They were an archetypical "Saturday Night Special", and since their striker firing design dates back to the '30s they are probably dangerous to carry with a round chambered. The only thing any good about them is that they are sort of a concealable gun, and one that if it works when the trigger is pulled someone might shoot someone with from a maximum range of 4 or 5 feet and if that was done they could probably die from it eventually, but not anytime soon enough to do you much good if the other person had a knife, piece of iron pipe, chain, broken bottle, hammer... whatever... maybe a ball point pen to shove up your nose.

    I'm amazed to see them talked about on the web as being worth $100 or more in really good shape, though $20 in the '60s had the buying power of $100 or more now... but because so many so much incredibly better guns are available now. I would suggest throwing that broken thing in the trash and buying something worth the money, even if it costs several times more money than a working EP25. The EP25 is a junk gun, even if not broken.

    But if you are a totally driven, hell-bent glutton for punishment: http://www.gun-parts.com/erma/
    Thoſe who would give up eſſential Liberty, to purchaſe a little temporary Safety, DESERVE neither Liberty nor Safety. - Pennſylvannia Aſſembly, 1755

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    Quote Originally Posted by SgtR View Post
    A poster has asked questions about a .25 ACP Erma on the WTB Board where they can't be answered... but here are some of my somewhat opinionated answers:

    To look for parts or whole guns, the correct nomenclature is Erma-Werke EP25 (oder wenn sie Deutsch sprechen, Erma-Werke EP25 Taschen-Pistole)...
    Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of the actual make/model (or the german translation). I am aware that they're cheap, junky, throwaway pistols where most of the members here, who are Kimber and Colt and Dan Wesson and Les Baer afficianados... Simply put just because the gun is cheaply made and old (probably kept in someone's toolbox for the past 20 years) doesn't mean it's not worth it to me to fix. It's cheap "crap" guns like that that I learn on so I don't screw up my more expensive pistols. Who wants to break out a set of files on a $700 pistol they just got? I'd MUCH rather learn on something "junky" than something that I spent a large portion of my income on. Aside from that, the EP25 isn't a bad gun when it's properly maintained (they're just hard to find that way because they were/are so cheap) and it happens to be the same model as the first centerfire pistol I ever fired.

    Now, if you have parts, I'd be interested in trading for them. If not... Thanks for the info, but the "cut your losses and bury it in the back yard" advice isn't suitable. Again, I appreciate the advice, but I'll still try for those parts if they can be had, thanks. I'm also aware that the frame is the regulated, serial numbered part and is, for all intents and purposes, the firearm. If they're such cheap garbage I shouldn't have too much trouble finding parts and another frame.

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    Elite Members SgtR's Avatar
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    Yeah... I'm answering myself, wanna make something of that?

    I just wanted to add... Don't think what I wrote is just some condescending elitist jaberwocky. I love junk guns. I've been known to buy multiple piles of 120-130 year-old rust with not the slightest idea that anything useable could be salvaged from them. Nor do I even own one of the sorts of guns I recommended. I tend to prefer somewhat older solid steel military handguns. The problem with those post-1945 Ermas is that they were junk when they were made, and they could never become anything more than junk, even in my sometimes vivid imagination.
    Thoſe who would give up eſſential Liberty, to purchaſe a little temporary Safety, DESERVE neither Liberty nor Safety. - Pennſylvannia Aſſembly, 1755

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    Elite Members SgtR's Avatar
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    Damn you are a fast typist. I'm not, which is one reason I don't post very often...
    Thoſe who would give up eſſential Liberty, to purchaſe a little temporary Safety, DESERVE neither Liberty nor Safety. - Pennſylvannia Aſſembly, 1755

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    I still have my first smithed on and in firable condition gun. Ready for this a raven P-25. A fine quality piece barrel is intergal with the frame, no ejector depends on the next round in the mag to push the spent one out, and has a rather unique slide hold open... it usually jams the last empty. I will on occasion carry it when I cant get away with much of anything else. The 1 1/2" barrel makes a hell of a bang and those little hollow points will still make holes big enough to get someones attention. Will hit the target at 20'. The .25 is a cool little cart the smallest considered reloadable.
    BATFE: Bureau of All Things Fun and Exciting
    http://youtu.be/1F0q8ffIsJo pretty much sums me up

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    ss1928, what did you do to your raven? not to highjack the thread but I have the same gun. PM me the details
    Trigger Happy Republican

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    Quote Originally Posted by mboy1981 View Post
    ss1928, what did you do to your raven? not to highjack the thread but I have the same gun. PM me the details
    Theres not much to do to them... when I got it the internals were rusted pretty solid, the firing pin was broken, missing the magazine, trigger bar right grip and mag latch. Took it completely to bits, derusted and cleaned, made a new trigger bar and firing pin, found a magazine and grips in a you guess em bin at a gun show, ordered the missing mag catch and spring from numrich. Got alot of why bother when I first started in on it the only thing I could say was it had a cool S/N.
    BATFE: Bureau of All Things Fun and Exciting
    http://youtu.be/1F0q8ffIsJo pretty much sums me up

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS1928 View Post
    The .25 is a cool little cart the smallest considered reloadable.
    I've reloaded .25 ACP including cast lead... and it's a hazardous little round to reload. Basically, if there is more than one by-the-book load for it I haven't found any... and it's an exact load, no more no less. It works fine for jacketed bullets. But guess what? Apparently that load won't work for lead bullets (there is no published load for lead bullets in .25 ACP). I destroyed a perfectly good Ortgies... the lead bullets didn't exit the bore and I didn't figure that out till I had fired three of them. The third shot buckled the slide. Typically lead bullets take less powder... and these were both sized and properly lubricated... so... I dunno. But at least I didn't blow up my Erma... or my other Ortgies... or my RG-26! ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWBoeY0AAec )

    All I'm sure of is that I don't want to do it again...
    Last edited by SgtR; 03-13-11 at 04:59 AM.
    Thoſe who would give up eſſential Liberty, to purchaſe a little temporary Safety, DESERVE neither Liberty nor Safety. - Pennſylvannia Aſſembly, 1755

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    I didn't think you were being elitist, SgtR. Far from it. I may have gotten pre-emptively defensive. I enjoy the "junk" guns quite a bit (I've refurbished a davis .380, a RG-22, another RG in .22LR, and now I've got this Erma to work on. I know where there's one in Ohio, but it's not worth what the guy is asking (a .22LR rifle of some sort) when you include shipping and transfer fees. That's why I'm looking locally, though I'll probably end up having to go looking on Gunbroker.

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    Elite Members SgtR's Avatar
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    I like to toy around with .25 ACP just for fun but would never consider that caliber for serious social purposes. All in all I consider a .22 to be far more deadly with the proviso that either can kill someone quite immediately stone dead with a direct hit on a key area... but odds are that someone shot at and/or hit with one but not kilt dead will most likely be in a beat-you-to death sort of fugue mood. Add to that my big hands and they tend to shoot extraordinarily low for me unless I really consciously work to counteract the tendency.

    I had a friend in the AF at Warner Robbins when I was in Army AIT in SC and spent a weekend at his father-in-law's farm in central Georgia. He had just bought a Saturday Night Special (probably a Röhm of some ilk or another) .22 revolver brand new for about $25 and we shot it quite a bit. That was over 40 years ago. That thing threw sparks, smoke, unburned powder and slivers of lead from the gap between the cylinder and barrel, all over the place. The Erma-Werke cheap exports were absolute works of art by comparison. I'm not sure which end of that gun was most dangerous... It probably is a good thing that the Saturday Night Special more or less got legislated out of existence but as in most such things there was a lot of collateral damage... for instance the non-importability of Walther's true PPK... and the stupid add-on safeties on historic hand guns that didn't need them.
    Thoſe who would give up eſſential Liberty, to purchaſe a little temporary Safety, DESERVE neither Liberty nor Safety. - Pennſylvannia Aſſembly, 1755

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